Originally Posted by Boredpayne
The confederate flag is a symbol of a body of states that went to war over the right to keep black people disenfranchised and enslaved. Your friend being nice to minorities doesn't make this less true.
That is totally incorrect. The confederate flag is a symbol of a body of states that went to war over the right to not be controlled by a central government that they didn't agree with. The union fought to retain the seceding states, not to end slavery in those states, that can simply be attributed to the limitation of state's rights and the abolitionist mentality of the majority. That said, anyone who has a confederate flag around is probably very stupid, you should still get your facts right though.
The problem with groups like this is that they want supremacy, not equality, whether it be feminism/black/hispanic/etc. This idiot is an idiot from a long line of idiots doing the same thing. Generating a siege mentality and hatred is a bad thing, regardless of ethnicity/gender/skin color/etc, as it will undoubtedly lead to thinking less of a particular group.
frankly, this is the only time i've ever agreed with the gist of what gorman is saying, which is shocking. Having these support groups may at times be necessary, but it's always more damaging than not.
Last edited by Hyde; Jun 16, 2013 at 08:56 AM.
Hoss.
Originally Posted by Hyde
That is totally incorrect. The confederate flag is a symbol of a body of states that went to war over the right to not be controlled by a central government that they didn't agree with.
GEE, I WONDER WHAT THEY DISAGREED ON.
Originally Posted by Lincoln's Official Platform
That we brand the recent re-opening of the African slave-trade, under the cover of our national flag, aided by perversions of judicial power, as a crime against humanity and a burning shame to our country and age; and we call upon Congress to take prompt and efficient measures for the total and final suppression of that execrable traffic.
http://www.civilwarinteractive.com/D...atform1860.htm
OH, PERHAPS IT'S THIS BIT, CONSIDERING SOUTHERN STATES WOULD ECONOMICALLY COLLAPSE WITHOUT SLAVERY
WEIRD, ABRAHAM LINCOLN THOUGHT IT WAS ABOUT SLAVERY TOO IN HIS SPEECH ON THE 1860 ELECTION
Originally Posted by Abraham Lincoln
"This question of Slavery was more important than any other; indeed, so much more important has it become that no other national question can even get a hearing just at present."
http://www.historyplace.com/lincoln/haven.htm
SO DO THESE SO-CALLED "PROFESSIONAL HISTORIANS"
Originally Posted by James McPherson
While one or more of these interpretations remain popular among the Sons of Confederate Veterans and other Southern heritage groups, few professional historians now subscribe to them. Of all these interpretations, the state's-rights argument is perhaps the weakest. It fails to ask the question, state's rights for what purpose? State's rights, or sovereignty, was always more a means than an end, an instrument to achieve a certain goal more than a principle.
Originally Posted by ImmortalPig
movements like black student unions or feminism only inflame relations and highlight differences, and often become platforms for counter-discrimination rather than aiming to remove discrimination.
Without feminism women wouldn't be able to vote. You're going to claim it has a negative impact or is a poor idea? How astonishingly ignorant of both you and Hyde.
Last edited by Boredpayne; Jun 16, 2013 at 10:24 AM.
Buy TC for a great price here! http://forum.toribash.com/showthread.php?t=240345
Buy VIP and Toriprime for a great price here! http://forum.toribash.com/showthread.php?t=237249
Hey look more than two lines.
Buy VIP and Toriprime for a great price here! http://forum.toribash.com/showthread.php?t=237249
Hey look more than two lines.
Originally Posted by Boredpayne
Without feminism women wouldn't be able to vote. You're going to claim it has a negative impact or is a poor idea? How astonishingly ignorant of both you and Hyde.
Without Newton gravity would never have been discovered.
Last edited by ImmortalPig; Jun 16, 2013 at 11:37 AM.
The war wasn't about slavery, it was about preventing the south from seceding. The reason for their secession was because of the majority and their abolitionist views, yes, but the war was not to force them to end slavery. It was to force them to stick with the union. I stated exactly that in my previous post.
The movement for the abolition and civil war coincide in history, the civil war did not happen because of slavery, the secession was caused by the major abolition movement, and the civil war happened because of the secession.
Regard your remark about feminism, yes, that is correct, hence why I said it is necessary at times, however i'd wager that modern day feminist groups aren't exactly looking for equality(although equality is a wonderful thing, it can't be achieved through means like this), such as the National Center for Women and Policing, the Feminist Majority Foundation, all of which are fairly popular feminist organizations with ridiculous ideology. They're basically on par with the KKK. Now, you may say that they aren't feminists, but, that's not how stuff works.
Women's rights are no longer an issue in the United States, anyone who says otherwise is utterly delusional. Discrimination in employment is prosecuted, there are laws to enforce equality, or in some cases supremacy(such as the blatant bias in divorce cases). There do not need to be organizations lobbying for more rights for people when we essentially all have equal rights. As an immigrant, both of my parents found it difficult to get good jobs for the first couple of years, and I was rather mistreated as a child on account of my difficulty with speaking english. Does that mean that I should start some sort of organization to lobby for rights that I already have? After getting fed up with the discrimination, my father reported it, and action was taken to end it. Lobbying organizations only need to exist when there is a need for them, not to stir shit hoping to give themselves more rights than the others. I am fully against what the idiot in the OP is doing, but, i'm also against other similar organizations that do jack shit today, even if they have accomplished things in the past.
The movement for the abolition and civil war coincide in history, the civil war did not happen because of slavery, the secession was caused by the major abolition movement, and the civil war happened because of the secession.
Regard your remark about feminism, yes, that is correct, hence why I said it is necessary at times, however i'd wager that modern day feminist groups aren't exactly looking for equality(although equality is a wonderful thing, it can't be achieved through means like this), such as the National Center for Women and Policing, the Feminist Majority Foundation, all of which are fairly popular feminist organizations with ridiculous ideology. They're basically on par with the KKK. Now, you may say that they aren't feminists, but, that's not how stuff works.
Women's rights are no longer an issue in the United States, anyone who says otherwise is utterly delusional. Discrimination in employment is prosecuted, there are laws to enforce equality, or in some cases supremacy(such as the blatant bias in divorce cases). There do not need to be organizations lobbying for more rights for people when we essentially all have equal rights. As an immigrant, both of my parents found it difficult to get good jobs for the first couple of years, and I was rather mistreated as a child on account of my difficulty with speaking english. Does that mean that I should start some sort of organization to lobby for rights that I already have? After getting fed up with the discrimination, my father reported it, and action was taken to end it. Lobbying organizations only need to exist when there is a need for them, not to stir shit hoping to give themselves more rights than the others. I am fully against what the idiot in the OP is doing, but, i'm also against other similar organizations that do jack shit today, even if they have accomplished things in the past.
Hoss.
Originally Posted by ImmortalPig
Without Newton gravity would never have been discovered.
Without scientists it sure wouldn't, but you didn't make that analogy to actually examine the argument, just step past it.
Originally Posted by Hyde
The war wasn't about slavery, it was about preventing the south from seceding.
And why were they seceding?
You can get as literal and pedantic as you want, at the end of the day you are/were peddling falsehoods that are an embarrassment to your credibility in future discussions.
Originally Posted by Hyde
Regard your remark about feminism, yes, that is correct,
So you're saying the damage feminism has done outweighs the pros of women's suffrage?
Originally Posted by Hyde
Women's rights are no longer an issue in the United States, anyone who says otherwise is utterly delusional.
Rights are not the entirety of equality.
Lmfao blatant bias in divorce cases.
Last edited by Boredpayne; Jun 16, 2013 at 03:41 PM.
Buy TC for a great price here! http://forum.toribash.com/showthread.php?t=240345
Buy VIP and Toriprime for a great price here! http://forum.toribash.com/showthread.php?t=237249
Hey look more than two lines.
Buy VIP and Toriprime for a great price here! http://forum.toribash.com/showthread.php?t=237249
Hey look more than two lines.
