Originally Posted by Ed

... or annie and brand skins

Originally Posted by Hippybob

He's the best lategame support because of his ult.

Originally Posted by AkumaBeast

but as a jungler, if he doesnt get kills or helps his team, he becomes more useless due to no damage, and as a jungler you want to deal damage on late game, not have 2 supports.

His ganks sure are crazy good but thats why you have to play extra carefully knowing you will end up winning.

Havent tried the patch but i heard hecarim is crazy on top lane.

Originally Posted by fat0ninja

No, you're wrong about that "herp derp jungler n33d d4maage". Dignitas runs a 3 support comp with kogmaw or some other hyper carry. And jungler's like nautilus, rammus etc. fall of damage-wise but are still GREAT junglers. So no. You're wrong. Alistar is a great jungler, and a great support.

Originally Posted by Hippybob

As the meta becomes more aggressive with counter jungling and such Alistar is losing his worth because he simply gets outjungled by dem Mundos and Shyvanas

Originally Posted by Oracle

No. Just no.

It's really annoying hearing this "it's the new meta" argument, because most of this "new meta" is really only applicable in high level, coordinated play.

In actual games, aggressive counter-jungling requires your team's support, otherwise you risk a counter-gank on yourself when you counter-jungle, due to ward setup. And if you counter-jungle an Alistar, you're guaranteed to not escape if they do set one up.

However, then I seem to fall into a paradox of demonizing one meta, while praising another. However, the counter-jungle meta requires team coordination to be effective. The highly effective ganker meta does not. Mundo can spend all the time he wants clearing the jungle, but if he tries to gank, he has low effectiveness. Shyv requires cc in lane if she so much as wants to touch the lane. Alistar just says fuck that and comes charging out of the bush with enough cc to terrify any team. He also fucks with their positioning, so you're pretty much boned.


And no, hecarim is much better as a solo top. His jungling is pretty lackluster, as he doesn't deal enough damage early game to make jungle clear time's good, nor prevent himself from taking too much damage. He doesn't have any real good sustains to keep up with it either. While his ganks hurt, they occur too few and far between for my liking, and can be ruined by how he approaches it. He also is fairly item defendant, so if you don't perform good early ganks, you lose effectiveness fairly quickly. Solo top is a much safer, and more effective, bet.