If you define a noob move as a move that tries to win as easy as possible, it is a logical conclusion that those moves are a pain in the ass. Which shovels are. So there is a good possiblity that you lose to those sometimes.

You are assuming that things such as "honour" and "fairness" actually matter.

Let me put this challenge to you: If such things do matter, and it is possible to win a match or many matches in a specific mode with a move that does not abide by those principles (which matter), should not the rules/possibilities of the relevant mode come under scrutiny?

I feel that if such "game-breaking" moves - the shovel is not one of those moves, but some such moves do exist - can be performed in certain modes, those modes need to be reviewed.

I'd say: don't blame the game, blame the player. It's not the games fault that it is abusable. Of course you can change the settings to avoid it but wouldn't it be much cooler if the players were 'fair' enough to not use them?
I'd say a shovel is really close to such a move because I know some player who have really hard-to-beat shovels. It was more than once I joined a server and saw them having a 40 streak using only 1 move.
I leave a server often when people start to try to beat me with cheap moves (after the match). I have no fun when I have to use a as determined move as theirs to beat them. The match is 100% predictable.

In my honest opinion if you define a move as "noob" then you should be able to beat it very easily should you not?

Last time i checked if you were called a noob you sucked.

Only fags play to win. (Repeating the same move over and over again isn't really fun, is it?)

Im not that Aikido pro, but i played my share of games as well and what i dont like about the shovel is not its sheer power. I have the feeling that it cuts the diversity of the mod. Only some openers can beat the shovel after the first turn, some cant, therefore, if you have to fear that your oponent might use shovel, you have a smaller amount of options. And some of those lost moves are strong and fun.
If you know hell use shovel, it shouldnt be that hard to beat him on the other side.

If you can't beat a shovel and you obnoxiously complain about it, you suck. Improve. Bottom line.

Your definition of fun doesn't apply to others.

yeah i agree with eleeleth
winning is pretty fun

if you lose though, live with it. i hate the people that start whining, which then turns into abuse.

if you lose to a repetitive move, then get over it, cause the other person will eventually. i mean, its them that would get bored easier cause your the one trying new moves, and trying to better whatever that repetitive move is.

Although, in toribash im pretty sure its hard to avoid people that are going to use the same move over and over just for some easy tc.
its inevitable.

Okay, to everybody basically saying " ur a fag cuz i cant beat a nooby move the like shovel" Heres a trick.
Plant your feet.
Grab their hands/arms.
Now here is the tricky part.
1. Throw them over ur head, behind you. Or!
2. Twist your chest, get them off balance. If you have two feet on the ground, and they have none, then there is no possible way for them to win.

Honestly people, it's simple, you only have to know a couple of basic concepts, such as traction and GRAVITY to freakin win.
Hope this helps some of you noobs win in aikido.


Oh and peter, whining that turned into abuse is EXACTLY what happened.