Originally Posted by azzeffir23

After playing more than like 100 games with quest rogue, i simply can't understand why people complain about this deck. I played all the fucking day with it and i faced only 1 or 2 quest rogues, the rest? FUCKING FACE HUNTER AND AGGRO DRUID WHAT THE FUCK?! How can you complain about quest rogue when i'm dead by turn 4 or 5 to aggro druid/face hunter? Vs pirate warrior i still have a little chance to comeback, but vs these atrocious decks i cant do shit with it. Quest rogue is absolute shit if the draw is bad. By the end of the day i lost 90% of my matches because i simply couldnt draw what i needed, i swear to god i wanted to punch my monitor.

Heartstone community is fucked up, again, QUEST ROGUE is good only if your draws are good, this deck is not cancerous at all because you have to think a little bit about your plays and also you have to depend on lucky draws. Any other quest is far more easy to do. Yes, i agree that if you draw completly insane or at least decent this quest is the best, but if you dont it's absolute crap. So i really hope heartstone community will stop crying about this deck and cry about the real cancer out there on the ladder.

Originally Posted by Bodhisattva

And what you end up with, is a meta triangle. If Hearthstone was a well designed game, that'd be fine. Because if it were a well designed game, shit like Taunt Warrior vs. Face Hunter would require both players to make intelligent decisions to win. But it's not :c

Originally Posted by cowmeat

Oh tell me about how people like savjz literally get top10 legend ranks with shit like recruit paladin. Of course there will be a meta structure in any given cardgame. Even RTS games like starcraft have a similar structure.

Sure pirate warrior and murlocs are a bit anti fun but the meta is currently super vibrant and so many things are viable. In the end there will always be hard counters, but complaining about counters in a TGC is like complaining about the sun getting up. That's the way cardgames work.

Ele shaman, pirate and taunt warrior, ele/jade shaman, quest and miracle rogue, midrange paladin and murloc architypes (and many more) are currently viable for ladder play. To say that hearthstone is not a well designed game while having so many viable decktypes is pure bs.

I'm currently playing with a version of recruit paladin and I am absolutely loving it. Teching the deck to counter most aggro (unless perfect draw) while still keeping lategame makes it possible to win against any deck type, granted I manage to play well. Complaining about the current meta just feels weird to me after only jade druid, renomage/lock and pirate warrior were a thing

Originally Posted by cowmeat

Complaining about reno is quite weird when reno isn't in standard anymore.

I would even argue that card draw is significantly less important in the current expansion since there is so much discover and meaningful RNG mechanics. Playing around and with the RNG/Discover mechanics creates so much variety and makes individual draw far less important. Also since the meta has slowed down for the most parts significantly (ungoro gave massive amounts of anti aggro tools) I don't understand when you say that there is less interaction.

Yeah shit draw will ruin the game and perfect draw will win you the game.
That's just how it is. Want no RNG or draw to have no effect, go play chess.

Originally Posted by Bodhisattva

Hearthstone, within the last few card expansions, has made draw order matter at an all time high.

Part of that has to include with the text that Reno, Kazakus, etc. read. 1 of everything in your deck means less draw consistency.

Originally Posted by cowmeat

That is literally complaining about reno, but let's not dwell on that one.

Well you say they should make hearthstone better, how?
Some actual improvements and not just "Less RNG"

Originally Posted by Bodhisattva

Well for one, introduce scrying. In Magic the Gathering, there are cards that let you look into the top however many cards of your deck, and rearrange them in the order of your choosing. The closest we have is Tracking, which is one class, and forces you to discard two of your three cards, which blows.

I think this is a good idea but a massive rework which is hardly going to be implemented and wouldn't really work with the current card set. A change like this would require a complete card rework since some things would become completely overpowered.

For second, lower the powerful effects of legendaries that breed archetypes and turn them into epics. Having less powerful effect placed on one card and doubling the amount of that card in the deck means it's less punishing to not draw the card and you're twice as likely to draw the card.

I don't agree with this. Cards like N'zoth are great and making two less powerful N'zoths doesn't feel the same. I can understand this point perfectly but personally I prefer how it currently is

For third, stop designing cards that are amazing to play on curve and really shit off curve. Less cards like Patches, Small Time Buccaneer, Totem Golem when it was a relevant problem. These cards have created the highest failure rate built into most decks in Hearthstone history. It used to be only Rogue had this type of built in failure rate based off "Will I draw Gadget in time", now even if you run a dragon deck, with like 8 dragons in your deck, you have a real chance to not draw a dragon at all when you need them and you just flat out lose.

I think they learned from this with un'goro. All the cards you listed were from previous expansions, while they still prove a problem I feel like it's being slowly corrected. Deckbuilding is always going to be a risk reward process, especially when it comes to decks like dragonpriest where it's a matter of how many dragons vs value spells you want to put in.

So there's 3 things: Add scrying, make some legendaries epics and make them less powerful doubling your consistency and lowering your power swings, and make less power swings cards that are garbage when not played perfectly on curve or with the perfect conditions and setup in your hard so there's just overall less power swings emphasized by the card drawing
mechanic.

I feel like these problems are all being slowly fixed with the new expansion, that's why I'm so critical about the idea that blizzard is making bad calls with the game. The only OP cards currently are the quests and getting those quests done can be done in such a variety of ways that it's not just "I have to hit this one legendary draw". It's no longer the reno meta.