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Old 3 Weeks Ago Original Post  
Dinis
 
9th Dan Black Belt
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,825



Abolishing excessive clan bureaucracy
If almost half (13 in 30) of the official clans in the game have a "De-Officialization" or "Activity warning" thread sticking out, don't you think this is completely unnecessary? You can't be fiending for those kilobytes that badly. This is only killing the members who come back every once in a while to reconnect with the old friends he made a couple of years ago.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #21
Smaguris
ub3r
 
Master Belt
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,788
Clan: Adventure



The idea of clan activity check sounds good on paper, but it absolutely fails in this scenario because of how Toribash clans are operated.

Most official clan members aren't interested in playing the game or using the clan forum, they have other means of communicating (e.g. discord), so it becomes a chore to play the game in order to keep the clan board.

Whoever implemented these checks clearly just did it just for the sake of doing something and didn't think it through. Or maybe some people just like to watch the world burn, seeing as pretty much everyone is outraged about it yet most staff defended this idea until recently.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #22
&Fear
 
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Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 3,385



can we at least pass the checks with forum activity alone? A clan is about community, why is having a strong community not a 100% pass criteria
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #23
Fade
????????????
 
Master Belt
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,620
Clan: win



hi everyone.

i'm here to let you all know that CS has been eyeing this thread. we are currently discussing all sorts of ideas towards a solution/compromise. as for now, feel free to suggest any of your crazy ideas about how you think checks should work. send your ideas to me or any of the other CS members, we're listening.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #24
Powas
Angry Pole
 
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 19
Clan: re



Embrace the entropy and hope that toribash next, if it ever happens, reiginites a spark of interest in some people, and then use the current system as a basis for something better, make a new start. Forcing activity right now won't do you any good.
There are a lot of ways you can approach the current situations, but here are some ideas:

1. Give old clans an option to retire. You could make a new subforum for such clans (could be hidden), move them to dead clans or simply mark as retired on the clan list. Retired clans would keep the square tags, the ability to post in their forums and wouldn't take part in activity checks. Some limitations could be introduced, such as:
- retired clans can't take part in in-game clan events (such as clan league) unless they prove their activity by passing a check month before such event starts. That'd require some additional communication between CS/ES and retired clans, to let them know that a clan event is coming.
- only clans older than X years can retire. I'd suggest 3 years but that's up for a discussion.
- retired clans can't recruit new members
- retired clans can't get points for clan perks as they are not part of the checks.

This way older generation of players, no longer actively engaged with the game itself, could stay as a part of community, while you could still keep active clans up to a certain standard.

2. Simple. Put the system on hold till the release of tb next, take that time to take a feedback from community and reinvent it.

3. Make it ,,3 failed checks within a year mean removal" instead of ,,3 warnings in 6 months". Get some more ideas for perks, give clans on ,,activity" streaks point modificators (f.ex x 0.5 for each active month), while clans in the yellow (warning) state get reduced perk points.
retired
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #25
Dinis
 
9th Dan Black Belt
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,825



Originally Posted by Fade View Post
hi everyone.

i'm here to let you all know that CS has been eyeing this thread. we are currently discussing all sorts of ideas towards a solution/compromise. as for now, feel free to suggest any of your crazy ideas about how you think checks should work. send your ideas to me or any of the other CS members, we're listening.

I think they should just not exist in such a small community. You're hunting a species that's going extinct. But if you insist on making rules for everything at least make the checks absurdly easy to pass and less frequent — this way the clans that wish to keep their official status will consistently keep it, and the clans that are legitimately dead will die.



Don't overthink it though, this is unnecessary. Before asking yourself the most efficient way to go about this, ask why you're doing this in the first place.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #26
Nike
Just Do It!
 
3rd Dan Black Belt
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 14,027
Clan: Liquor



Automating the check is good.
But could you change the system a bit to the point where a clan could stay alive just by being forum active. To my current understanding, no matter how much you post / play ingame the point you will get just the maximum point of those area, why not make it if it is already on the maximum point it still could increase but not as easy as before it reach that maximum area?
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #27
$Thrandir
relics of a dead game
 
9th Dan Black Belt
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 5
Clan: re



Just make it carrot instead of the stick. At this point killing clans makes very little sense, make the checks easier to pass so that only clans with nobody caring are deleted. Give more prominent prizes for active clans. Make events for clans with sneak peeks some time earlier (like 2-4 weeks) informing that only clans with X points of activity will be allowed to take part in them so that they put their effort into doing so. Just goddamn make people WANT to be active because it's cool, profitable, fun instead of throwing clans which were part of their life for a long time into the trash because "you don't need it with this level of activity anyway". We certainly don't need them for almost anything, but we go out of the way to fight for it anyway - that should show you as the staff that we still have some, even if very little - attachment to this game and if you ever want to make it active (for example when Toribash Next comes) with our force, it might be good idea to cherish this instead of pushing forward with policy which users clearly hate.

And you prefer to throw it into the dirt anyway, for what? What were good things you've noticed in the community after introducing this system? Except of occasional activity spikes from some players who were forced to play, because I mean global statistics - did you see increase of average posts per month? Did you see increase of active players pool and average time they spend in toribash? Did you see community being happy about this experiment?

Last edited by Thrandir; 2 Weeks Ago at 10:19 AM..
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #28
Wounder
woman driver no survivor
 
8th Dan Black Belt
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 887
Clan: win



This issue, hell even this thread alone proves how disassociated high ranking staff members are from the actual game / community, it truly is a shame. 100% of the normal players who have posted here are against the way the clan system is currently in place, yet they are deciding to keep it the way it is anyway, it's almost like talking to a brick wall.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #29
§Tuna
<º))))><
 
7th Dan Black Belt
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,574
Clan: Evolution



As Thrandir said, make it a carrot instead of a stick.
Give clans meaningful rewards for activity. Something like the top 5 or 10 clans get special recognition over just being in that bracket, or clans that reach a certain age. Incentive for activity instead of punishment for inactivity.

Right now it's as if the CS are intentionally killing off the game.

For a lot of people there's more reason to be active on the forums than there is to continue playing a game that some of us have played for over a decade now. The current system is obviously broken.

Ele is also correct in saying that the automation lacks the human touch. It doesn't have the same level of discretion that is required.

Instead of putting the effort into an automated clan system, it would have made more sense to put that effort into making new ways for the ES to make the game interesting. New regular events. With, most importantly, new tools for them to utilise, host new automated events so that their workload is alleviated. God knows they need that more than the CS. But hey, hindsight is 20/20, I'm sure Duck had good intentions when he rolled the new system out, if it was even him.

It's just time to accept that it didn't work.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #30
Frost
clan mods are better than event noobs
 
Break Belt
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,128
Clan: Liquor



I have been sitting at my desk for an hour to figure out how to say what has been on my mind.

On the topic of "Purging" and "De-Officialization" lies a question on my own mind, "Why the hell do we even need to do this? Threatening to remove something is so counteractive that it just ruins gaming experience." Wouldn't it make more sense for there to be options instead of just the shiny red DELETE button?

Then this came to mind and was mentioned in a post prior to this: Have a clan retire from the community. Retire means
to leave your job or stop working because of having reached a particular age or because of ill health, or to cause someone or something to stop being employed or used.

What jobs have the clans done to even deserve to retire? Do the Clan Squad even want to deal with the hassle of coming up with requirements to retire, and if so, is this not a better option than receiving Legendary Status? When you get Legendary, you are allowed one thread to talk, still facing death, but you keep the brackets instead of parentheses.

But wait, you guys want an option to keep the entire forum, keep the brackets, AND not deal with Activity Checks? Wow, unfair.

Legendary status outranks "Retiring" any day of the week. I'd rather be in a Hall of Fame somewhere, knowing my legacy has impacted the lives of many. and be dead, instead of retiring.

If I missed it, I apologize, but I have YET to see someone who received legendary status (Clan Only) complain about only having a thread and being listed as dead.

You are given the option to revive the clan, get official back, and get the forums back. Its only away forever if you are lazy enough or do not have time to do it, and if that is the case, why do you even bother complaining. One thread is easy enough to message each other if for some reason the forums are your ONLY form of communication.

There are clans that are official and deserve to keep it. Adventure, Obey, Liquor, Undead, TANG, etc. They are active on both forums and in-game and show little to no signs of stopping. If you are not like these clans, why do you even have a right to complain?

This is only my opinion. I do not feel like responding to anything else, only stating what currently is on my mind.

Tl,Dr: Good luck.
---------------
Onto my other topic:

Clan Checks should be done for every clan, not just official. Equal rights to all, right?

Last edited by Frost; 2 Weeks Ago at 10:07 PM..
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