Greetings, those who dare enter into the world of longposts about, well, mainly cheating, whether it be dice, cards, boardgames tests, or just on your girlfriend, you'll find advice on how to cheat on/at them here.
Interesting anecdotes to come.
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The bottom palm, might be one of the most perfect moves ever deviced, i am of course talking so greatly of the Erdnase Method No. 1 Bottom Palm. Even the second version is great substitute/supplement. The first method however, which this post is dedicated to will be praised here, a second post of the advantages of the second method might very well follow shortly.

This bottom palm is superb for executing it's use, to palm, i.e. to "steal" and hold some cards in your hand seceretly, from the bottom is a usefull skill if you are sufficient in the art of bottom dealing, otherwise, the move is completely useless. One exception would be if you are employing some kind of "withholding" advantage, which is one of the most common ways of cheating when it comes to card games, though, for this purpose, you seldom need the bottom palm, unless in a game where either the whole of the deck, or most of it is dealt out.

An other usage for the move is when you need to "hold out" a set number of cards, since you can easily decide the number of cards palmed while employing this bottom palming, this, however also have limited usage, but can be an affordable weapon at the card table.

It can be said that with only the knowledge of but three ruses, one of which is indeed the bottom palm, one can achieve an advantage so great, an absolute neophyte could defeat the best poker player on the planet. Those ruses being the following:

Retaining the bottom stock.
Bottom palming.
Bottom dealing.

With these three subterfuges, a clever player can, when he finds opportunity to, simply place a good hand, or part of one, when it is his turn to deal, on the bottom of the deck while gathering up the cards, then proceed to blind shuffle, retaining the bottom stock, palming the bottom cards for the cut, and finally replace and deal them from the bottom to himself or an ally.

Depending on your style of cheating, the top palm might be better, especially if you are playing a game where relatively few cards are dealt, like blackjack or hold 'em, since in those situations it can be more favorable to stock the cards rather than to reserve them for a bottom deal.

Now on to the move itself:

The move is fast as a flash when performed as Erdnase instructs, and quite invissible to any but a highly suspicious player. It is silent, and the cards are automatically plamed in a very natural position and fits very nice within the hand. The hardest thing about the ruse is probably the replacing, but if you have done the palm correctly, the other players will not suspect anything of you if you handle the cards a bit awkwardly when replacing, since they will not know that you have palmed some cards before.

With some practice, it is quite possible to replace the cards to the top of the deck, but this action is highly liable to detection and really is only suitable for magic purposes.

tl'dr
short post pls?

upp basically became the post quality god after i stepped down and i appreciate him making a thread for all his cardistry, cheating and other endeavours to be explained in detail.
but seriously he makes the best posts now

Up(p)date:

While i was experimenting with the bottom palm, i think i finally got the perfect method for me down, and also i noticed that it can be performed by using the pinky, instead of the second finger, but all that is just a pointless technicality, one better suited for a more interested company, no, for the neophytes, if you excuse my harsh language, i think theory is a better choice for a choosen subject of that to be discussed. Linguistic flairs aside, let's continue the update:

I have also become much better at a method of bottom dealing called "strike bottoms", as opposed to the more traditional "push-off bottoms", this deal is arguably faster and more unnoticable, but this is quite subjective. I believe that it depends on how you are naturally dealing the cards, some people deal them in a way that would make one method a clear choice, while others would choose a different one. Most experts agree that the strike method is the best, but the push-off has it's benefits, for example, it is much easier to use the push-off method if the deck you are handling is quite depleted,. i.e. has been handled by bunglers with sweaty hands, and has lost most of it's frictionless qualities.

Oh how i look forward to scamming my fellow classmates when i get back, rob them of their "studial-money". One might call this wicked, but i justify it by simply quoting Erdnase:

"We have neither grievance against the fraternity nor sympathy for so called "victims." A varied experience has impressed us with the belief that all men who play for any considerable stakes are looking for the best of it."

I wished I still post like uppkicker in this generation in the other generation it was apparent that it was annoying I did it for a while but sadly it's not going to happen anytime soon unless it's on a assignment or documentary folder

To full-grip, or not to full-grip.

A makeshift title indeed, but let me explain further:

The full-grip, or full grip, as it is known by by the initiated, is a way of holding the deck that is perhaps the most common method used by neophytes, or "unlicked cubs". I will give a short description of the grip itself:

The deck lies across the left palm, as is usual for dealing. The left thumb is resting on top of the deck, ready to push off the top card at will, while all of the fingers are laying against the opposite side, squeezing the deck against the ball of the thumb.
This grip will fly in any game where hand grips are allowed, since it appears that you cannot execute any subterfuges from it. This is believed because:

1: You're exposing the entire front end of the deck, since all the fingers are held at the side.

2: You would have to move the four fingers out of the way if you were to bottom deal, whichwould be easily noted.

3: It shows that you are a "normal" player, that does not know of any "mechanical" ways of holding the deck.

While these are all true, you can certainly perform certain subterfuges from this grip, in fact, there is one that you can arguably do exclusively from this grip alone, that is, keeping the bottom palm while dealing, which, in turn, eliminates the need for bottom dealing, "by proxy".
It is, however, harder to perform the bottom deal from this grip, and any attempts at "deal shifts" i.e. shifts that are performed during, or directly after or before the deal has begun, when the grip has been adopted. This, because of point No.1. The "Longitudal Shift" may be used here, but a heavily modified one, which would not fly in fast company.

Note that the shifts themselves, would not be any harder to execute from this grip, but the break that is usually held by a finger, can be more easily spotted when there are no fingers covering the front of the deck, or stabilizing it.

It is also, just generally and uncomfortable grip, which certainly makes certain slights more difficult.

The best grip for holding a standard break would most likely be the "mechanics grip", or the gene-maze grip. For bottom dealing, i would say that the trusty Erdnase grip is perfect. Of ourse it depends on what exact bottom deal you are using, certain ones actually are designed to work exclusively with the full grip.

An other grip that would be worth mentioning is the "Straddle-grip", a relative to the mechanics grip, which i will describe now:

Mechanics grip:

The deck is held like the full grip, but with the exception of it being held slightly higher up , so that it is just barely touching the palm, and it is not squeezed, so much as just held between the fingers and thumb-ball. The first finger is held at the front end, which gives the deck more stability, and can cover any breaks at the front, that might be seen if using the full grip.

The "Straddle-grip" is very much like the mechanics one, the only difference is that the pinky is held at the inner end, so as to give even more stability.

The daily routine:

It is general knowledge that one has to maintain one's qualities by means of constant, and persistent practice. I, as many others, believe the same. Therefore, i will now describe in the most pleasant to read way possible, the various tasks that i perform every day to "keep sharp".

"Off-table moves":

I Named these set of exercises "Off-table moves" because of the general nature of them. They are truly, off-table, i.e. the deck is not touching a table. These include things like top and bottom palm, various fans, faro shuffles, fancy-ass sybil cuts, springs and other flourishes.

I usually perform all of these "slights" in rapid succession, repeated, while on my way home on the weird bus/train hybrid public transportation vehicle we have here.

Then we get to:

"Riffles and cuts"

The above title does not accurately describe all of the moves i do, but it does describe some.
In this set, i practice pretty much everything where i have to use a table, but also a bit of palming. Also blind shuffles, both on and off table.

Thhis set is practiced while i'm seated, either in my lovely bed, sofa or chair, with a table in front of me, and a looking glass opposite.

Up(p)date:

Things are going well, the bottom palm is going well, top palm nearly done and bottom palm almost done as well. I believe that by the time i turn 18, which is soon, i'll be well equipped to face anyone who dare challenge me at the age old tradition of card games. I seek to be the best, first in Gothenburg, then Sweden, then the world.

The future is looking bright.

"I want to be the very best, like no one ever was"
- Unknown

A defense* of Erdnase:

So, many experienced users on "The Magic Café" website have barraged pretty much the entire Erdnase book for being "outdated". Well, in this post i will lay forth some arguments against this notion that the Erdnasian methods would be outdated.

Argument number one:

"Noone plays draw anymore!"

Counter:

The methods described in Erdnase that deal with Five Card Draw can all be used in Hold 'em.

Argument number two:

"It has crappy bottom and second deals!"

Counter:

The bottom deal, while it requires a lot of work, certainly works on slow company. It might fall short when used on fast company, so this might be a semi-valid point. A substitute for the deal is needed for fast companies, though it is very good to learn the original deal: Since it is so hard to master it is great practice, and once you have mastered it, most other bottom deals will be as smooth-flowing as melted butter.

Regarding the second deal, it is perfectly good for both fast and slow company. Though it must be said that in a "real game", you would seldom need the second deal, due to it pretty much is a companion of the "marked deck".

Argument number three:

"The Erdnase grip sucks!"

Counter:

The general argument that the grip sucks is based on two things: Difficulty of attaining the grip, and that it is a "weird looking grip".

Regarding point one; this is completely false, i can get to the grip with one hand in half a second, no problem. So this point must only be made by people who has not practiced the grip at all.

And now we come to the bulk of the post; point two; that it is a "weird looking grip". In this section i will also include the fourth argument used by anti-Erdnasians.

First of all, it's only a weird looking grip to those who has never seen any other grip than the square grip, i.e. neophytes.
Second, because it's weird it makes it more noticeable, while this is true, the amount of people who even know what an "Erdnase grip" is, is extremely small, and keeps declining.

Now the fourth argument that people put forth is that the whole book, being written in 1902, has this aura of "ye olde times" over all of it's slights. I.e. a lot of the moves are executed in such a manner that it looks like you are a pro when you handle the cards. This would have been no problem in "ye olden days", since pretty much EVERYONE knew how to handle cards with some degree of elegance. Now a days, not a single fuck seems to know it. So if you follow the instructions in Erdnase, you'll look like a pro, which is not good, since people will suspect you of your skill.

What this argument leaves out is that since most people are "recarded", they will not really think much of it if someone handles cards like a pro, they'll just think that "that guy has played a lot of poker", or something. Most people don't even know what a "bottom deal" or a "top palm" is. A lot of people in this day and age don't think there is even a way you CAN cheat at cards.Therefore, the argument that because you handle cards with elegance means that people will become suspicious does not hold up.






* I like how you can write either "defence" or "defense", since they are both correct.

Up(p)date:

Things going very well, almost finished with bottom deal, top palm and bottom palm. I am looking forward to scamming the new kids at my school when i start.

Will you put any vids of you practising here? That would be quite interesting to watch. I haven't touch a cards deck in weeks.