TFC 5
Originally Posted by FatTomato View Post
what the frick is toribash


ragdoll fighting game physics fighting game ragdoll fighting physics funmotion joints martial arts karate pc mac free game turn based game


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Hi, hoping to share some experience and whatever, and just ask some questions.I've not played the mod so this comes from a purely speculative point of view having just read the thread.
  • Modified body
  • Stronger limbs and abs
  • Stronger wrists and ankles
  • Fractures
  • Higher dismember threshold (fracture threshold too)
  • Slightly longer reaction time
  • Self damage


Some things that jump out at me are the modified body. How exactly is it modified? Is it in terms of size or just a precursor for the changes you state afterwards? Stronger limbs, abs, wrists and ankles leaves you with it just being standard dmt on chest and head joints? Curious as to the logic behind this given that a large part of tk has always been dismembering limbs as a form of defence. My concern here is that the idea is to make people more aggressive, but it could potentially have the opposite effect when they realise that they don't need to worry about their limbs breaking on blocks. I feel like there is an argument both ways but if there's any confusion I think recent meta has shown us that people will always favour a defensive tactic.
Frac tk has always been present as a niche thing, and a novelty, with the reason being that taekkyon has always been the mod where you get booms and cool replays. Fractures have a tendency to ruin that, so I'm curious about your thoughts on that aspect.
A minor increase to dmt is always welcome in tk tbh, but in combination with a limbs I wonder to what degree it becomes a short form grappling mod.
RT being longer is again, always welcome. TK requires thought and anything that impedes that has always been counter intuitive in my eyes.
Self damage is one of the things that acts as a deterrent in ErthTk. People don't (didn't) generally like it as it was seen as harsh. If you goal is to create a popular taekkyon mod then self damage may not be the way to go, from experience, however if your goal is simply to make a fun mod then I agree, self damage is wonderful. I just think you may need to clarify your goals, as there are conflicting messages.


Food for thought, I've not played taekkyon competitively in years, so all of this comes with a solid dose of "whatever gramps".
Last edited by Erth; 1 Week Ago at 03:38 PM.
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Originally Posted by Erth View Post
How exactly is it modified? Is it in terms of size or just a precursor for the changes you state afterwards? Stronger limbs, abs, wrists and ankles leaves you with it just being standard dmt on chest and head joints? Curious as to the logic behind this given that a large part of tk has always been dismembering limbs as a form of defence. My concern here is that the idea is to make people more aggressive, but it could potentially have the opposite effect when they realise that they don't need to worry about their limbs breaking on blocks. I feel like there is an argument both ways but if there's any confusion I think recent meta has shown us that people will always favour a defensive tactic.


The body modification isn't really extensive, for one I enlarged all the torso, shoulder and hip joints by 0.1. Then I edited the shape of the arms a little bit, most notably changing hands from squares to rectangles, functioning more as real life hands. I also closed up the gap between the breast bodypart and the neck joint (which also comes with the head itself ofc), effectively making decaps more challenging in that matter. Next up is torso, which has been widened to the sides a little bit, also serving the "more realistic" function, but also making it just a bit easier to land a strike on the torso. Shins have been shrunk down by a 0.1, purely just for aesthetic purposes. And lastly, feet had seen a minor alteration too, meaning that the range the ankle joints can extend/contract to had been slightly increased.


There is also a screenshot showcasing how the body looks now in the "Screenshots" spoiler.


About the strength of the joints, I've tweaked the strength of several joints (most notably shoulders, elbows, hips and knees) to balance out the increase of the overall body mass (caused by joints getting larger, as adressed above).
I have noticed that this change also allows quicker movements, either when setting up an attack or trying to defend an attack (effectively also balancing out the overall increase in the dismember threshold and fracture threshold). Breaking your opponents wrists is still a viable defense strategy, ofcourse a little harder to execute now (I have tested this part out myself, when Haku broke my wrist during my opener 3 times in a row).


To adress your concern, during my first stage of development, the mod was somewhat favoring agressive playstyles, since you really can build up a big amount of momentum in a very short time period, which i decided to counter by enabling fractures and raising up the dismember threshold. While there definitely is plenty of distinctions between this iteration of the mod and the original one, I'm pretty confident that the core mechanics are still preserved (and build upon).


Originally Posted by Erth View Post
Frac tk has always been present as a niche thing, and a novelty, with the reason being that taekkyon has always been the mod where you get booms and cool replays. Fractures have a tendency to ruin that, so I'm curious about your thoughts on that aspect.
A minor increase to dmt is always welcome in tk tbh, but in combination with a limbs I wonder to what degree it becomes a short form grappling mod.


I agree with you that taekkyon is a very beautiful mod and allows you to score some cool replays, but at this point of time, I feel like there needs to be a change to make it somewhat popular again. My reasoning behind enabling the fractures is quite simple, to shift the mod a little bit from being a cool replay factory for people who are good at the mod, to more competetive and overall massapealing mod.
Due to many changes I've adressed above here, increased dm threshold is really mandatory at this point, but it's not too high to prevent well prepared attacks from yielding what makes taekkyon, taekkyon.


Originally Posted by Erth View Post
RT being longer is again, always welcome. TK requires thought and anything that impedes that has always been counter intuitive in my eyes.
Self damage is one of the things that acts as a deterrent in ErthTk. People don't (didn't) generally like it as it was seen as harsh. If you goal is to create a popular taekkyon mod then self damage may not be the way to go, from experience, however if your goal is simply to make a fun mod then I agree, self damage is wonderful. I just think you may need to clarify your goals, as there are conflicting messages.


The reaction time change is pretty much due to the reason you have correctly stated, but not too extensive where it would give players too much time to act. I agree with you, that taekkyon played against a skilled player often requires a certain level of thought, hence the reason why I also decided to increase it a little.


For the self damage, this change was suggested to me by Haku. I think you are absolutely right that it might deter away some people, but I figured it's a very interesting game mechanic (that has also been lost in time) that you also have to keep a track of, plus I figured it could somewhat benefit players who are skilled enough to not be affected by this feature in a negative way. I might remove this feature in the future.



Originally Posted by Erth View Post
Food for thought, I've not played taekkyon competitively in years, so all of this comes with a solid dose of "whatever gramps".


I am very grateful that you took your time to write up this response, I really am. Your feedback is as valid to be as anyone elses (perhaps even more important, since you are in fact the person who made ErthTk), regardless of the fact that you haven't played taekkyon competetively in years. If you happened to wish to discuss the mod development further, or provide some other feedback, I will be more than happy to get in contact. Once again, thank you for stopping by.



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Originally Posted by Zephh View Post
For the self damage, this change was suggested to me by Haku. I think you are absolutely right that it might deter away some people, but I figured it's a very interesting game mechanic (that has also been lost in time) that you also have to keep a track of, plus I figured it could somewhat benefit players who are skilled enough to not be affected by this feature in a negative way. I might remove this feature in the future.

I think the main issue with self damage as a deterrent in ErthTk is self dm's, but I didn't experience any in this mod because of the higher dmt. That may be because I was careful to avoid it, but I'm also careful to avoid self dm's in ErthTk - and I certainly still do it in that mod. Of course points are a factor, but it doesn't take a lot of care to avoid the point side of self damage in general, where in ErthTk unexpected self dm's do happen sometimes. I think it's good to have self damage to encourage cleaner movement and avoid weird tangles - one of the reasons I enjoy ErthTk. No goatses in tk please lol.


I had fun playing the mod a few days ago. What i liked most was that it emphasises the improv aspect of tk, where the latter half of the match can be the most important moments and it's not all about the opener, encouraging good improvisation to win instead of relying only on a snapkick or only on grab-defense openers (pick your flavour).


It's a fresh take on tk and I think it has a lot of potential for competition. I look forward to watching and participating in any future tourneys hosted with it.
Originally Posted by DrGonz View Post
I think the main issue with self damage as a deterrent in ErthTk is self dm's, but I didn't experience any in this mod because of the higher dmt. That may be because I was careful to avoid it, but I'm also careful to avoid self dm's in ErthTk - and I certainly still do it in that mod. Of course points are a factor, but it doesn't take a lot of care to avoid the point side of self damage in general, where in ErthTk unexpected self dm's do happen sometimes. I think it's good to have self damage to encourage cleaner movement and avoid weird tangles - one of the reasons I enjoy ErthTk. No goatses in tk please lol.


I had fun playing the mod a few days ago. What i liked most was that it emphasises the improv aspect of tk, where the latter half of the match can be the most important moments and it's not all about the opener, encouraging good improvisation to win instead of relying only on a snapkick or only on grab-defense openers (pick your flavour).


It's a fresh take on tk and I think it has a lot of potential for competition. I look forward to watching and participating in any future tourneys hosted with it.


Yeah that's a another thing. Due to the way my mod plays out, compared to ErthTk, I don't see it being as big of a "game changer" as it sometimes could be in ErthTk. Well, atleast so far I don't think it's that big of a deal. But as I adressed already I am inclined to removing it, since as Erth very validly pointed out that in some way it counters one of the goals I set for the mod.


Also thanks for the kind words, there already was one ETourney played with the mod and I'd say that it went quite nicely (big thanks to Fire and Kane!!!).



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Originally Posted by Oaky View Post
I wanna play the mod with you :>


Yes!!! I want to play with you too! Since I'm home quarantined for like 3rd week now I'm pretty much free all day long, so we definitely have to play it together some time soon.



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